Thursday, March 5, 2009

Who Is Good And Who Is Bad?

I am stumped by the ongoing discussion in the media about the “good” Taliban and the “bad” Taliban…Until now I thought all Talibs were bad…Kind, generous, helpful, honest, respectful, and loving are some qualities I associate with a “good” person and I can’t see any of these qualities in the Taliban (okay, some individual members may have certain good qualities but the organization as a whole is bad)…

According to some strategists in Pakistan and the US, the ultra conservative Pakistani Talibs are good because they are interested only in the local affairs of Swat whereas the other Talibs are bad because their interests are global and therefore their actions would affect other countries…Even if the Pakistani Talibs have only local interests, how can they still be called good? Didn’t they terrorize the citizens of Swat to such an extent that thousands had to flee? Didn’t they destroy hundreds of schools and ban girls from attending them? Didn’t they ban women from working and leaving their homes alone? Didn’t they force women to wear burqas and men to grow beards and wear salwar kameezes? How can such people be called good? Just because the Pakistani Talibs are at the moment only interested in local affairs does not mean that they don’t have national and global ambitions…Anyone who forcefully enforces Sharia rule necessarily believes in Islamic domination of the world and will go to any extent to achieve that goal…

Talibs are all bad because they are intolerant, violent and are hell bent on taking the world back to the Stone Age - all in the name of religion…The Pakistani government cannot justify its incompetence and its deal with Maulana Fazlullah by defining the Maulana's group as "good"...

Edited to Add:

The 'good' Taliban at work

The Hindu reports:

PESHAWAR: Islamist terrorists on Thursday blew up the mausoleum of a 17th century poet in Peshawar, apparently because women visited it. It was revered in both Pakistan and Afghanistan.

Comments (24)

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Good one Bones.... yeah... I dont know the complete details, but people are talking about the good and bad taliban....
For me, Taliban is Taliban.... anybody who opposesmy right to a good life is one....:)
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
The 'good' Taliban business is a PR exercise for the Pak govt. ...Why are they good?Because they are open to dialogue unlike the Afghani Taliban i.e the deal between the govt. the Talibs...PR campaign to hide the defects of the govt. and the army...The Pak govt. like the Taliban is full of crap...
So will we have good terrorists and bad terrorists now , good being those who target the armed forces or the police , and the bad ones , who kill innocent civilians ? Is it a dumb Pakistan or a delusional Pakistan ?
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
Maybe, Pakistan is intelligent...They are spinning their incompetence in containing the Taliban in Swat by saying they are the good guys...They've got Americans believing this thesis...Pakistan's definition of "good" is entirely different from the rest of the world's...
This question is so darn dumb ..I mean which moron came up with this definition?
A government... a freaking govt of a country thats big enough and capable enough bows down to the Taliban ...the President of the country says we have made a 'deal' with taliban...
then does a prompt backtracking after the Lahore attack and now says ''no deal with the taliban!'

make up your mind dude!

Why do I have a sneaking suspicion that an AMerican came up with this definition?only they could be delusional enough

I tell you pakistan has lost it and one can only feel sorry ,really sorry for the Aam Pakistani at this point.....I mean the sheer horror and fear going through their minds at this point?can barely imagine it..

a nation is disintegrating before our eyes...

really hop they dont..and some miracle occurs
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
Indyeah, you are right about the Americans coming up with this concept of good and bad Taliban but they must have been fed the BS by the Pakistanis...They figured if the Pak Taliban were open to dialogue, they could use them to talk to the Afghani Taliban...
Thanks for the tag...I'll do it...
Just shows how far we can go in politics. Anything can be justified and made worthy of a debate. I am stumped too, but also frightened, doesn't bode well...
The "good" Talban are the ones who kill only locals and Indians and put their own women in sacks. The "bad" ones are the ones who want to kill Americans too. The Americans are being sold this story that they should not worry about the growth of the good Talban and look the other way as they go about their business in the sub-continent.

If the Americans buy this bullshit, which even Fareed Zakaria seems to have bought, then they have to be totally dumb. I mean how can they forget that the bad Talibanis were supported by the Americans when they were fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan? Then they too were "good". Once you hand over a loaded rifle to a maniacal killer, you have to be really foolish to trust him to keep the barrel pointed away from you!
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
Not only is the US dumb for buying into this bullshit but this thesis of "good" and "bad" Taliban is simplistic and defeatist...It is sending out wrong signals to the militants...

How can the Pak Taliban be good when one of their main aims is to form bases to train militants for the war against the US and NATO in Afghanistan?

I was reading on a Pakistani site that the reason 12,000 armymen couldn't defeat 3000 Talibs is because the army doesn't like killing their own countrymen...Basically, the army has no training in counterinsurgency tactics in which the 'bad' guys are flushed out - they are only trained in conventional land warfare to tackle India...
Sabyasachi Ghose's avatar

Sabyasachi Ghose · 839 weeks ago

Couldn't agree with you more.my treading is that Zardari having signed the deal with the Talibsd, and facing flaks from all around, has come out with this implausible theory to justify his decision.
goofy mumma's avatar

goofy mumma · 839 weeks ago

Very true Bones. The already created the Mujaihideen which is now killing it, and are creating another Frankenstien in the Taliban. When will Pakistan learn from its mistakes i wonder. The country is doomed by its own hands!
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
When will the US learn?Why do they believe Pak?The CIA funded the Mujahideen during the Afghan-Soviet war, now they are believing the Pak's and supporting their deal with the Taliban in Swat...Our neighbour really has a hold on the US...

The US is also desperate...They are fighting a losing war...By 'sanctioning' extremists, they are creating a bigger mess...

Pak is now blaming RAW for the attack on the SL cricket team...Yesterday, they blamed the Afghans (the bad Taliban)...They are not even considering the good Taliban...

"The evidence which we have got shows that these terrorists entered from across the border from India," Sardar Nabil Ahmed Gabol, Minister of State for Shipping, told private Geo television. "This was a conspiracy to defame Pakistan internationally." - Reuters
May be the US needs to redefine evil . Has anyone of you seen Charlie Wilson's War ? It is about how the US helped the Mujahideen . Very interesting movie .
Did I miss something? Who is arguing from "good" Taliban's side? Seriously! is there such an argument?

So as long as some loony men trouble their lot and follow primitive rules, everyone is fine but if it affects global situation then Talibanis are bad. USA is ONLY worried about that. Aaargh! UN too.
When I read that I couldn't believe that there are some good talibans and the explanation they are giving for that is really laughable.. even if it is for local affairs those people were suffering because of that. Pakistan has become a failed state.. they are not even able to prevent their people from the religious goons.. and the women were deprived of every rights... that is not the one has to live in this world..
The day is not long, when those Talibans take the support of Pakistan army and capture the government and turn it into another Afghanistan.

I have heard the news about taliban in Swat region by november itself.. but nothing has been done by the Pakistan government.. Poor Pakistan people.. they are helpless :(
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
Welcome!!!
Yes, Pakistan will soon be controlled by the Taliban...Worrisome for India...
Our politicians are too dependent on religious and caste things to get votes. This is a trick they are using to keep the people divided and they are enjoying. There are some constituencies in our country where a person belongs to single caste has been contesting and winning continously. What we can call this is, a divide and rule....__I can never accept Congress or any other party as a secular one.. the day they are shurgging of these cheap politics and fielding the qualified canditates to serve the people, is the day I will respect and accept them. __Sanjay Dutt has applied in SC to get his case cleared so that he can contest in LS elections. What is the service he is going to do for this country? He openly admitted that Cinema will be his first passion. Even in that passionate job he didn't created any record. So we can expect a zero performance from him. Why SP is still going behind him? Are they concerned about people or not?__Govinda is another dump person who never did anything useful as MP. But the congress party for sure will give ticket to him. ____Something new must be happened in Indian politics to remove these corrupted parties and politicians.
1 reply · active 839 weeks ago
I read somewhere that Govinda will not get a ticket because he had nearly zero attendance in parliament & didn't meet or do anything for his constituents...I hope what I read is right...

Amar Singh loves courting celebrities - it seems to me that SP will soon be renamed 'Celebrity Party'...They tried to rope in Sourav Ganguly but thankfully he refused...

No politician or political party is concerned about the citizens...These days nobody gets into this dirty game (yes, it has become a dirty business) for public service...
That's a funny nomenclature. And you're right about how there can't be any good in what the Talibs do.

Instead of good and bad, they should be called bad and worse Talibs :P
I usually don't like generalizations-but have to agree with you on this. Taliban in any form is bad.
"When will the US learn?Why do they believe Pak?"

I dont think they do.I would not be in a hurry to doubt the US/Pentagon`s intelligence. They are not dumb(even though Joe Biden is no Dick Cheney!). Remember the drones that keep bombing West Pakistan and The Pentagon says, " I have no idea what you`re talking about!"???
I do think the US has some other plans. Yes, they are supporting the alliance with the Talibs but I do think they have some larger motive in mind..
As for India, ofcourse its becoming more and more dangerous - this alliance will only makes things worse. I wonder what kind of world we are leaving behind for our children.
Any talk or cease fire with fundamentalists will be suicidal.
Pakistan Army want Taliban to win in Afghanistan.Otherwise they feel Indian influence there will increase.At the same time they do not want Taliban to question their authority in Pakistan.But Pak Taliban is strong enough now to question Pak Army.The mullah-army nexus cannot be wished away in few days.So some regiments of Pak Army is reluctant to fight Taliban.
One should rememeber that Taliban was hugely popular in Afghanistan few years ago.When the corrupt and cruel war lords were tearing apart the country ,Taliban many thought will be their saviour.They became popular with the methods of instant justice and no corruption. But the cruelity and violence against women,ban on cinema,music and fundamentalistic ideology made them unpopular.

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